Turkey Expels Israel's Ambassador, Cuts Military Ties
iamsowise last edited by
Egypt,Libya and now Turkey ....Blow after blow after blow for America and Israel....
Turkey has expelled Israel's ambassador to Ankara. Turkish Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoglu announced Ankara's expulsion of the Israeli ambassador, along with a suspension of all military agreements with Israel, in a short statement to the media.
He said Turkey is reducing its relations with Israel to the level of second secretary, and expects the ambassador to leave by Wednesday.
These are not blows for US but it is a new colonization tactics. However I have great hopes with Turkish leadership. They may turn the tables, may become Muslim Super Power. Inshallah
Pakistan was destined to be a Muslim Super Power but unfortunately our leadership after Jinnah damaged this country tremendously. All the leaders after Jinnah were biased and worked for their own objectives not for our country.
semirza last edited by
PM this user
Turkey has humiliated Israel by downgrading and limiting the Israeli mission in Turkey to the level of second secretary. It has expelled the Israeli Ambassador, its Military Attache, Counsel General and first secretary.
A detailed analysis of the move is given by the Pakistani think tank Albab:
Analysis: Turkey downgrades ties with Israel
hariskhan last edited by
@pakistani47: That's where you are wrong.
Its not the leaders. Its the people who choose such leaders.
Go to the root of the problem. Fixing symptoms has gotten us no where in the past 60+ years.
haider3 last edited by
If I may give my view on Turkey, too. Seems to me Turkey is playing a very dangerous game indeed. The first inkling of this new, Turkish "game" came some months ago as Erdogan started attacking Syria in the most uncalled for manner. I still haven't quite managed to make sense of those events.
Now, Syria set aside, Turkey is playing the diehard opponent of Israel and the protector of Gaza. At the same time, it has invited NATO to enter Turkey with both troops and a "missile defence system", much to the horror of a protesting Russia. Too many games being played all together, I'd say. The real face of Turkey is no longer visible to my eyes. Well, time will tell.
pakistani47, I do beg pardon, but I think you might be underestimating Pakistan and the historical role it is required to play in years to come. HK seems to be saying the same thing above.
Look: The real leader of the ummah will be the country which has sacrificed the most for the ummah. From that point of view, only Pakistan among the big Muslim countries qualifies. Our war dead, our shaheed, along with those of Afghanistan, will be our proof that we have achieved the most for the sanity and safety of fellow Muslims. Turkey is nothing but a copy of the west model, here today and gone tomorrow. I don't mean Turkey now, I mean the model. They'll have to do better and find something else.
Did we elect/select our leaders like Ayoub Khan Yahya Ziaul Haq Bhutto Junejo, BB NS Mush and now AZ? No my dear you are wrong. Correct your facts. All these leaders were imposed on us. I have great respects for Qazi Sahib and I siad that in my recent posts that he could have benn our best leader? But unfortunately he could not cope with politics of deceit of Mush and JUI.
You have every right to differ so do I. I am Pakistani not Turk and I can give my life for my beloved country if required. But first I am Muslim. So I have more concern for Ummah. Please read my comments about Turks in my post "Rise of Turkey & Allama Iqbal. If I write them again it would displease other Mirza Sahib.
You are right on this point that due to our history of deceit and treachery we become suspicious about everybody. But I think Turkish PM could be a real leader of Ummah. He can become new Suleman Alishan, Sultan Muhammad Fatih or Salahuddin Ayoubi. These all great people were Turks.
haider3 last edited by
pakistani47, if you are right about Erdogan, I'll be the first to cheer. I've had such high hopes of him along and now I no longer know what to think. But I still believe my point about Pakistan and its future greatness is not do be disdained either. We are a great country.
"Suleman Alishan, Sultan Muhammad Fatih or Salahuddin Ayoubi. These all great people were Turks."
They were Muslims and not "Turks". We should refrain from callling them Turks as it encourages nationalism. BTW, Salauddin Ayoubi RA was not a Turk but a Kurd from Northern Iraq. Ata Turk in his fake nationalistic pursuit called the "Kurds" as 'Mountain Turks" denying them status and hence the problem continues until today. The Kurds are Muslims but have different language and culture but they were always part of Ummah until the collapse of Ottoman Caliphate gave birth to several banana secular Arab and Turkish republic. The Arabs especially the Baathist Alawite thugs of Syria and Iraq took out Salaudin Ayoubi from school text books because they said he was "not an Arab". This is the sick mentality of nationalistic Turks and Arabs. The poor Kurds never got a homeland and are squeezed between Iran, Syria, Turkey, Lebanon and some other Arab countries. I am not encouraging Kurdistan but trying to say how nationalism destroyed and continues to destroy the Ummah.
@ Abdul Rehman,
You are right. We must not call them Turks. But as our regligion teaches us that we are divided into tribes just for sake of identification.
Well on other point, you once yourself said that Mughals were also Turks whereas they were not. They were tatars. Babar was grandson of Ameer Taimur a Tatar.
Turks is name a very vast and great tribe. Present day Turkaman, Uzbeks and many others were considered Turks in earlier time but now they are divided and sub divided. Anyway this matter is debatable. But it does not worth going into detailed discussion.
Even if you know father of Maulana Rumi was Iranian and he migrated to modern day Turkey so can we call him Turk.
In conclusion I would say I am impressed with your knowledge of history and religion. Only few people are available here with whom one can discuss these interesting topics. Most of the bloggers just follow their respective party lines.
Thanks for the post and your kind comments. I have only limited knowledge. I think the word Mongol,Tatar and Turkish have synonymous meaning in relation to ethnicity. All speak a Turkish dialect. One of my Turkish friend from Istanbul worked as a contractor in Russia and Central Asia and said he could could communicate easily in Turkish with Tatars, Azeris and Central Asians.
As far as I know the Tatars are also identical with Turks. Their language is a Turkish dialect. Three set of Turkish tribes came out of Central Asia. One group went towards Mideast and Europe and were Ottomans(Osmanli), the other group went towarsd Russia and they were Tatars( There is a semi autonomous Muslim Republic of Tatarstan in Russia today) and the third group were Mughals who went to the sub continent. But all their origin was from Central Asia.
The Turkic people display a great variety of ethnic types. They possess physical features ranging from Caucasoid to Northern Mongoloid. Mongoloid and Caucasoid facial structure is common among many Turkic groups, such as Chuvash people, Tatars, Kazakhs, Uzbeks, Hazaras, and Bashkirs.
banjarbayabaan last edited by
scandinavian last edited by
Turkey suspends Israel defence ties over Gaza aid raid
Israeli navy commandos intercepted the Mavi Marmara and other ships
Turkish PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan has said his country is suspending all defence ties with Israel.
The move follows the expulsion of Israel's ambassador over its refusal to apologise for the 2010 raid on a flotilla of activists heading for Gaza, in which nine Turks were killed.
A UN report has concluded that Israel used "excessive force" in its raid, but that the naval blockade was legal.
Turkey has vowed to take the case to the International Court of Justice.
Based in The Hague, the ICJ is a permanent UN court set up to rule on state-to-state disputes.
In reality, experts say it is unlikely Turkey will be able to take Israel to the ICJ since, under court rules, Israel would need to give its consent for the action to be heard.
Mr Erdogan said Turkey was "totally suspending" defence ties with Israel, after downgrading diplomatic relations with the country.
"Trade ties, military ties, regarding defence industry ties, we are completely suspending them," he told reporters in Ankara. "This process will be followed by different measures."
Turkey expelled the Israeli ambassador on 2 September and also suspended military co-operation with Israel last week.
Israel has expressed regret for the loss of lives.
But Mr Erdogan described the raid as "savagery" and accused Israel of acting like "a spoiled boy" in the region.
A US state department spokeswoman expressed concern over the row between the two countries, urging them to "de-escalate" their dispute.
"Our emphasis with both the government of Turkey and the government of Israel is to hope that we can de-escalate, we can defuse, and we can get them back to talking about improving their relationship," Agence France Presse quoted spokeswoman Victoria Nuland as saying.
The two countries have had substantial military co-operation during the past two decades, but that has decreased in recent years, says the BBC's Jonathan Head in Istanbul.
If there were any doubts about Turkey's attitude to its once-lucrative defence arrangements with Israel, Mr Erdogan has dispelled them, he says.
However, most of the deals with Israeli companies, like the upgrading of Turkey's US-made jets and tanks, have already been completed.
The last of 10 advanced drones, or unmanned aircraft, have been delivered, and Turkey does not plan to buy any more. But it may still need Israeli technical assistance to operate those drones, which play an important role in the war against Kurdish insurgents, adds our correspondent.
Turkey's manufacture of Israeli-designed armoured vehicles - essential equipment for the soldiers fighting in the south-east - could also be affected.
In the past, the Turkish armed forces might have been able to stop such a break in relations with their Israeli counterparts.
But this year, the generals are for the first time firmly under the thumb of a civilian government, which is determined to show its displeasure with Israel, says our correspondent.
The nine pro-Palestinian activists who died were on board the Turkish-flagged ship, Mavi Marmara, when it was intercepted by the Israeli navy in international waters as it sailed towards Gaza's coast on 31 May 2010.
At the time, the Israeli military said its commandos fired live rounds only after being attacked with clubs, knives and guns. But activists on board said the commandos started shooting as soon as they hit the deck.
The UN inquiry found Israel's naval blockade had been "imposed as a legitimate security measure in order to prevent weapons from entering Gaza by sea and its implementation complied with the requirements of international law".
It said Israeli troops had faced "significant, organised and violent resistance from a group of passengers" and were therefore required to use force for their own protection.
But it also said Israel's decision to board the vessels "with such substantial force at a great distance from the blockade zone and with no final warning immediately prior to the boarding was excessive and unreasonable".
The report noted "forensic evidence showing that most of the deceased were shot multiple times, including in the back, or at close range".
scandinavian last edited by
Turkey is engaged in a very complex game. It has been made complex by the former rulers of Turkey since AtaTurks time. It is not a left hand job to get out of the spider network of issues, so we must show patience. After all Turkey has made tremendous gains in the past 5 years, We should not expect over night changes on all issues. Wait and see what unfolds. After all they have taken many right steps and I expect Erdogan to take many more right steps in the direction we all want to see Turkey. In between we will also see steps we do not agree with and steps which Turkey is forced to take because earlier deals and commitments. In another 5 years we will see the true face of Turkey, inshallah! I can already see what it will become - given the fact that people like Erdogan are allowed to rule and are heavily supported by the Turkish people. Let's pray for the betterment of our Turkish brothers!
adonis last edited by
Turkey is fast becoming the leader of Muslim world because it has started speaking in sync with the sentiments of Muslim masses. Its support for uprisings in Egypt, Libya and Syria and for the rights of Palestinians clearly shows that the current Turkish leadership is unwilling to be shackled by diplomatic niceties anymore and calls a spade a spade.
But this achievement has not come by in one or two years. Turkey was beset by an overpowering military and scores of Martial law. But after the last martial law in 1980s, the democratic process started anew in Turkey. For the first 15-20 years of that process, there was a lot of instability with weak governments, coalitions, horse trading and a lot of corruption. But the democratic process continued. The currently ruling AK party first came into power in 2002 and has won two elections since then, each with increase in its votes. This party has not only brought stability and prosperity to Turkey but has also cut the military to its size vastly reducing its influence.
There is a lessons for Pakistan in all this. We must not abandon the democratic process. Emotional slogans are cheap but progress can only be achieved by patience and perseverance. Democracy has to flourish and with the passage of time, all the problems that are currently facing Pakistan will be overcome. Calls to revolution and bangladesh model etc will only bring anarchy and we'll have to start anew every few years.
It is time that we show maturity and learn something from the success of democracy in Turkey.
Guest last edited by
in another post i mentioned Turkey's role in Somalia. Somalia is a huge concern for the muslims as there is a war going there as well as worst hit drought and famine. It was the turkish pm who visited Somalia in Mogadisho which is highly unstable and security is fragile. Turkey has shown that it cares for the muslim brothers outside of turkey, whether its Palestine or Africa. This i think was a big step and show of confidence and support for Africa.
There is no doubt about the intention of Turkey but they should also know the facts about the country's upheavels. Somalia is in grip of war and also a devastating famine. The country is ruled by a warlord Sharif who is propped in power by African Union mercenaries. Shairf is same as Karzai of Afghaistan and African Union troops are same as NATO. Any aid that Turkey gives will be siphoned off by corrupt warlords like Sharif.
Guest last edited by
@AR.. i think the somalian people can answer that better. The reality is Turkey has made an impact in somalia by going to Mogadisho and showing its support to the "people". Did any other country dare to go and show support?
remember, its the people who are dying not the al shabab or shareef...whoever is in the govt doesnt matter....turkey went there for the people.
the rest is just noise.....
dusky last edited by
"Any aid that Turkey gives will be siphoned off by corrupt warlords like Sharif."
And what is the alternative beside letting people die?
We have a sizable Somali community in Toronto and surrounding, I was involve with them for Somalia relief efforts during Ramzan. According to them no one dare to go into the Al-Shabb controlled areas for relief efforts as they kicked out all the charities from their controlled areas (including Islamic charities) over two years ago. Now they change their stance after people greatly suffer in their controlled areas and they smell a complete backlash from the locals but it's already late.
So yes, Sharif's are not saint but their is no other viable alternative either to help the poor Somalis who are suffering from famine.
saladin89 last edited by
well done to turkey for what they did, hopefully we can follow the footsteps of turkey under the leadership of Imran Khan (very similar people, however if IK becomes leader than surely Pakistan will exceed inshaallah Turkey).
Lets go back to the topic. As of today, Israel has refused to apologize or pay compensation for the illfated Flotilla massacre that killed innocent Turks on a humanitarian mission. This was mandated by a UN resolution too. It should be remembered that when Turks confront Israel, they are actually confronting US, NATO and EU which are in turn controlled by Zionists. It will be long battle and will require immense sacrifices. It is not going to be easy like Turkish army occupying one third of Cyprus to protect the ethnic Turkish minority.