‘Admitting you are a secularist can get you killed in Pakistan’



  • KARACHI: Urdu linguists have distorted the meaning of the word “secular,” and falsely translated it as la-deen (non-religious). The use of the word is so dangerous now that even mainstream leftist political parties in the country are afraid of talking about it.

    Civil society representatives highlighted these points as they participated in a seminar titled ‘Democracy and secularism in Pakistan: Its need and importance’, at the Arts Council on Saturday. The event was organised by the Forum for Secular Pakistan. The participants urged political leaders to push for a secular state, “as there can be no democracy in the country without secularism”.

    Prof. Dr Jaffar Ahmed, the chairperson of the Pakistan Study Centre, criticised Urdu linguists for “distorting” the meaning of ‘secular’ in earlier dictionaries. The word was originally used to refer to the small pieces of land that common people used to hold in the days when the Catholic Church would own most of the land. The word came to symbolise scientific inventions and progressive thought in the 19th century, he said.

    Senator Hasil Bizenjo said that secularism had become, perhaps, the most difficult subject to talk about in the country. “If someone says that he is secular, people would kill him on the spot.” He said that only three to four political parties in the country had mentioned the word in their manifestos.

    On the other hand, monarchs, as well as democratic governments, have been using religion to strengthen their rule for centuries. However, there have been a few prominent rulers, including the founder of the Mughal dynasty, who had grown worried over the amalgamation of religion with state affairs, said I A Rehman, the secretary general of the Human Rights Commission of Pakistan. “For democracy to survive, it is necessary for the state to stay neutral when it came to religion.”



  • I dont think so, even back in Zia period i knew many NSF friends who openly call themself "la deen", atheist or communist ... but that was golden days of pakistan or may be when hate was just planted ....



  • All Text books compiled after the Objective Resolution in 1949, where 'Secular' was interpreted as

    La-Deen (non religious), was done purposely

    Most of the Members at Text Book Board, were orthodox and addicts of religious allusion.

    Such intellectual dishonesty was supported and patronized by Nawa-i-Waqt school of Thought, which was dominated by 'Taliban' of that era who wanted to make Pakistan

    A Theocracy.

    Secular is politically used for the system of Governance in a State---not for a person.

    A person living in a Secular State as a citizen has all privileges to enjoy his/her faith.



  • ضیاء صاحب۔۔۔۔۔۔

    یہاں اسی فورم پر نوائے وقت جیسا عظیم اخبار چاٹ چاٹ کر ذہنی معذوری کی بلندیوں تک پہنچنے والے ایسے ایسے بے غیرتِ اعلیٰ تک موجود ہیں جن کو کینیڈا میں سیکولرازم پسند ہے لیکن پاکستان کیلئے سیکولرازم حرام ہے۔۔۔۔۔۔

    :-) ;-) :-)



  • By religion I'm a Muslim, but politically I'm a secularist.

    I remember those days when this word was being misinterpreted by some mulla mentality, not by Urdu linguists, as La-deeni.

    As a matter of fact such mulla mentality were told by their bosses that these secularists are communists or socialists who are the enemies of Islam. That's how this word became unacceptable to such translators.The exact meaning of 'secular' means in Urdu a Duniadaar Insaan. And that has got nothing to do with faith. This kind of translation shows how backward and uneducated such people are. You can check any dictionary. I'm a multilingual and I know what I'm talking about. Thanks



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  • @BlackSheep

    Name such fellows... "Parda uthao esey logon per se"



  • Right wing media, fasadi molvis, politicians and writers have been abusing the word secular for long time.



  • @EP bhai

    "Perdey mein rehney do perda na utaho"

    "Perda jo uteh gaya to.....

    BS sahib ki to izaat saadaat bhi jaaye g agar bachi ho to.



  • Name such fellows... "Parda uthao esey logon per se"

    وہی جنہوں نے کینٰیڈا کی شہریت حاصل کرنے کیلئے ملکہ اور اس کی آل اولاد کی تاحیات وفاداری کا حلف جیوے جیوے پاکستان کی پسِ پردہ موسیقی پر اٹھایا تھا۔۔۔۔۔۔

    :-) ;-) :-)



  • @BS

    آپکا مطلب بابا چابی والا ہی ھے نا، میں سمجھہ گیا طاھر القادری----ھھھھھھھھا



  • آپکا مطلب بابا چابی والا ہی ھے نا، میں سمجھہ گیا طاھر القادری----ھھھھھھھھا

    ہاہاہاہاہاہاہاہا۔۔۔۔۔۔

    آپ کچھ حد تک صحیح سمجھے ہیں۔۔۔۔۔۔ وہ اس فورم کا چابی والا باوا میرا مطلب چابی والا بابا ہی ہے۔۔۔۔۔۔

    :-) ;-) :-)



  • آپ کچھ حد تک صحیح سمجھے ہیں۔

    @ BS

    آپ حد ادب تک غلط سمجھے ھیں ، باوا جی میرے بڑے معزز دوست ھیں ، میں انکے متعلق ایسا کیسے لکھہ سکتا ھوں ---اور نہ ہی ایسا سوچ سکتا ھوں


    آپ دو دوستوں کو لڑوا کر پھا پھا کٹنی کا رول کیوں ادا کررھے ھیں----ھھھھھھھا



  • گلریز صاحب۔۔۔۔۔۔

    معزز بلاگر کے معزز ہونے میں کس کافر کو انکار ہے۔۔۔۔۔۔ جو معزز ہوتے ہیں وہی تو جیوے جیوے پاکستان کی دُھن پر ملکہ کی تاحیات وفاداری کا حلف اٹھاتے ہیں۔۔۔۔۔۔

    بے شک مجھے ان کے معزز ہونے میں کوئی شک و شبہ نہیں۔۔۔۔۔۔ خدا کو میں مانتا نہیں ورنہ یہی دعا کرتا کہ مجھے کبھی اتنا معزز نہ بنانا۔۔۔۔۔۔

    :-) ;-) :-)



  • It's always interesting to see tattay chuck Qadianis discussing Islam and secularism



  • ملکہ کی تاحیات وفاداری کا حلف اٹھاتے ہیں

    @ BS sb

    میں تو "ھر قسم " کی اور "ھر عمر"کی ملکہ کی وفاداری کاحلف بغیر اٹھائے ادا کرتا ھوں ، تو کیا اسکا مطلب ھوا کہ میں محب وطن نھیں رھا اور ناقابل اعتبار ھوگیا


    اگر کسی نے قبر میں پیر لٹکائے اور بڈڈھی ٹھڈڈی ملکہ کا اسکا دل رکھنے کو حلف لے لیا تو اسمیں کیا حرج ھے---آخر کو مذھب میں بھی تو " تقییہ" کی اجازت ھے---یہی تو فائدہ ھے مذھب کا---موجاں ھی موجاں


    جیسے چاھے موڑلو----آپ بھی مذھبی بن جاؤ---بات آسان ھوجائے گی


    بس ھر بات پر تقییہ کرلو



  • جی پی بھائی

    آپ غلط سمجھے ہیں بلیک شیپ صاحب کو آپ تریاق یا نیولے یا پانی یا سے مماثلت دے سکتے ہیں یہ بڑے کام کے آدمی ہیں



  • lol @volcano

    لگتا ہے بچوں کو برکی چھتر یاد آرہا ہے



  • @Volcano

    Stop erupting!

    Admit the facts (historical and current); word secular and its interpretation have been grossly done in Pakistani society by radical fasadi molvis, right wing politicians, media and writers.

    Why is it so hard to 'call spade a spade' in Pakistai society as well as on PkPolitics?



  • With the kind of fragmentation we have developed in our country, at times if one gets into the hands of an opposing party, admitting to whoever one is, or admitting to whichever school of thought one belongs to , or admitting whichever religion one belongs to or admitting whichever language one speaks , or admitting whichever part of the country one belongs to one could attract some hatred or even get killed.