True lies of Pakistan



  • There are lots of cooked up facts in our history books. I was wondering if scholars at this forum can possibly highlight those cooked up facts for our coming generation.

    I know about following:

    1. We won war of 1965.

    2. We won war of 1971.

    3. We defeated India in Kargil.

    4. Balochistan voluntarily became part of Pakistan.

    5. Bengalis still want to join Pakistan.

    6. All muslims are brothers.

    7. We are as we are because Yakhood-o-nisara are conspiring against us.

    8. We'll bring down USA as we did to USSR.



  • ONE WORD = D.E.N.I.A.L

    we are living in a surreal world where we are the center of our own universe and where going wrong or doing wrong is just something that the "others" do.

    dodh k dhullay hain hum, sazishon main palay hain hum..tararumpumpum tararumpumpum tararumpumpum!!

    chor na yar kya deewar main takar mar nay ki koshish kar raha hay!



  • @Uscher

    Lots of nations have gone through such phases when they live in denial. We can come out of it but for that we have to constantly struggle. Otherwise we will sink even deeper into miseries and hardships or even become extinct.



  • after watching the majority of us being denial even in the condition that we presently find ourselves in i have lost all hope.

    For me we are just those who are bound to fail (period)

    i mean can't you see its an on going process and the writing is on the wall!, the first phase was completed way back in 71 when we lost the first half of our country and now its just the turn of the rest.

    Any hope of resurrection from this point is also a kind of denial to me.

    So yes i am happy even to be a loser because at least losing also makes me feel a part of this world, anything else and i am also living in a fools paradise and there is nothing that i hate much!



  • @Uscher

    All I can say to you, I'm hopeful Alhamdulilah. I think we are just little too dheet. But I don't think we are incurable.



  • stupid discussion..fehim23 needs to research more



  • @Fahim,

    no1. every history book is a bundle of twisted facts .

    its not we alone,who make our children read twisted facts ...

    believe me.

    no2. All muslims are brothers .

    it is a fact ..written in Holy Quran .

    not in a book of twisted facts .

    so we all need to respect this thought .

    no3..u really need to talk to some indian students and asked them what they have been teach about Pakistan?

    how they treat facts?

    no4..in history books u always find a one sided story.

    if u read books about DHAKA Fall ...

    u will go mad about twisting stories towards one side in one book and 180 degree twist in the facts in another book .

    no5. its all about your beliefs.

    if u believe Bhutto was an angle .

    u are going to believe in the book of history ...who is saying so by ignoring the facts about him being a feudal lord talking about so called socialism ,being a drinker talking about islam and declaring Fridays off ...being a US salve and posing as a fighter against US ...

    if u believe that Bhutto was a devil...than u r going to trust the book of history ,which author is saying so .

    because that is jelling well with your existing perceptions about Bhutto.

    in that case..u will ignore his achievements like Atomic plant initiave & 1973 constitution ...

    in Mass Comm ...this is called Uses and Gratification Theory.

    u always tend to believe the info...which matches with your existing pieces of info in your minds ....

    the piece of info ...matches with your existing info GRATIFIES your mind and your mind accept that piece of info as FACT.

    this theory simply fits from all twisted facts based history books to all current affair shows on TV too.



  • Congrats! , We have the first stereo-typical response of the thread!...just wait a bit and there would be myriad of them!



  • @ucsher,

    waiting impatiently for your revolutionary vision based comments...where are they ?



  • @Beenai

    1. I know History is written by rulers and so it is twisted and un-authentic. But if you are truth seeker you should state what is right. It is not hard to find truth only if you take off the specs of bias and prejudice. And that is why I posted this message, to highlight the twists of History and Facts (IMO of course) our rulers have done. So that our coming generation is not taught the twisted history. I hope you got the point.

    2. Quran tells us that "All humankind is the descendent of Adam and Eve, and therefore we all SHOULD be brother". For muslims it is even more strongly emphasized by Prophet (PBUH) that we SHOULD act and behave like brothers. But the fact of the matter is we are NOT brothers. Though we should be if we believe on Quran. If you want to personally experience this so called "brotherhood", go to any shop keeper in Pakistan, or go to any Middle eastern country.

    3. We should not care what Indians, Americans, Jews teach their children. If we claim that we should abide by Truth. thn regardless of what Indians, Americans, and Jews are doing to thr children, we should teach our children what is truth.

    4. You are right that most of books present one-sided story. But I believe God has given us a very beautiful and powerful organ that is called Brain which can filter out the truth from different sides of stories and with little research.

    5. I consider it a disgrace to the human intellect when s/he cannot differentiate between right/truth and wrong/lie. And only believes on things according to his/her personal biases and prejudices. One who does that should not even call him/herself Human being. I believe to qualify as a human being, one should first see the facts and then make its belief and should not stick to it for ever. S/he should always be open to absorb new views and facts.

    You are very right when you say that we as human beings have the tendency to believe what we like to hear or see. Often our self intrests dictate the choices we make. But on the other hand, we also have the power to resist our basic instincts and decide against our own "intrest" when we are to choose between right and wrong. To be prejudice, biased, angry or hateful is part of human nature, to control all these negative characteristics of human personality is also possible for us.

    And the one thing that helps us to control these negative characteristics of our personality is Education which eventually transforms to Knowledge.



  • The circumstantial evidences uncover the reality of a historical event.

    The ground reality takes time to get an acceptable shape.

    1. One history book represents Mohmood Ghaznavi as a Muslim Hero where he invaded the Temple of Somnatha for 17 times.

    The second book paints him as a dacoit and robber.

    2. A majority of people respects M.A. Jinnah as the founder of a Nation, where a number of historians take him as an agent to the British Government.

    3. For many the creation of Pakistan was the right policy where others take that as a conspiracy to dismember India.

    4. Leaders like Liaqat Ali Khan, Ayub Khan, Z.A. Bhutto, Zia-ul-Haq, Benazir, Musharraf, Nawaz Sharif, and Imran Khan are the victims of same mentality and trends of approach.

    5. To reach the ground reality one needs common sense to perform a rational, realistic, factual and comparative analysis.

    6. A claim (such as, 'All Muslims are Brothers' Two Nation Theory) remains a hoax until it is proved otherwise.



  • Rome was not built in a day.

    so as theories ..............

    every theory has its background .....

    there are many ups n downs of time...

    which makes an individual then an opinion leader and then a nation thinks in a particular way and that is called THEORY .

    if socialism is a theory and a system of governance ...that means it has been though out well before its implementations and with the passage of time it changes its shape.....

    same goes with your likes ,dislikes ,theories and visions.

    TWO NATION THEORY doesn't came out in a day.

    it was not the thought of an individual.

    it was a cumulative feeling.

    named by one individual as two nation theory.



  • We should not ignore the principle of

    'Survival of the fittest'

    Social sciences are known as abstract as 2+2 never equals to 4 in a social theory.

    Social, Political and Economic Theory stays alive to play its role during a particular period of history until it is ousted, repealed or deleted by a more refined and improved version.

    A theory generated to stir the emotions is always short lived as compared to a doctrine stemmed out of reason.

    "ishq kehta hai ke uth aor husni-dunnya loot le

    aqal kehti hai ke apni aabroo mahfooz rakh"



  • @Fahim23

    1. We won war of 1965?

    The fact is India lost this war on the western front. Pakistan captured a total of 400 sq miles Indian territory (not a tall claim but a fact) on this front. I am talking about Chumnb and Jowraian sectors on West Pakistan borders. Other than these two, India also lost territory on Kathua and Sachet Garh sectors as well. There was no confrontation of any importance on the eastern front.

    1. We won war of 1971?

    Not much happened on the western borders other than India changed its war tactics and ignored all of Geneva Convention, bombing west Pakistani cities such as Sialkot. On the eastern front, after Dacca Fall, Pakistani army (90,000) soldiers surrendered to India. We lost the war.

    1. We defeated India in Kargil?

    I will call it a misadventure on the part of Mr. Musharaf. Nawaz Sharif had been taken into confidence. India was caught off guard. Most of the intrusion in Indian territory was done by non-military personnel. Pak military was better equipped and therefore able to maintain control on the peaks ( please refer to Indian media reports of the time). Nawaz Sharif was summoned to US. After his return Pakistan army returned to former positions. Nothing gained or ceded. Media is not correct at times and will never be where top secret military affairs are concerned.

    1. Blochistan voluntarily became part of Pakistan?

    As far as feudal lords of Balochistan are concerned they did opted for Pakistan.

    First in line were the ‘Khans of Kallat’. They also had their own system of law

    and order similar to the Jirga system of NWFP.

    1. Bengalis still want to join Pakistan?

    Not majority of Bengalis, especially those born after 1971. In Pakistan they have

    been smuggled into the country under the disguise of biharis. Opposite is the

    Truth. Here we were forced to take tough decisions to ban all bangladeshis for

    sensitive or positions of authority jobs because primarily of their anti Pakistani secret agendas (most had Pakistani passports) and these decisions are effective on both, bengalis from Pakistan or from Bangladesh. The facts are that a very large majority is involved in crimes of all sorts. Authorities have arrested

    convicted and deported them in large numbers and is continuously doing so.

    Immigration bans have proven futile attempts. Murderers, pimps, prostitutes, gamblers, thieves, are prominent crimes found in this ethnic group at a very large percentage. Sadly though, we consider ourselves lucky that for whatever reasons they are off our backs because here and other countries we have observed, being a bengali means living an insult.

    1. All muslims are brothers?

    This should be self explanatory. Just ‘muslim ummah’, if it is derived from the Arabic word Umm meaning mother, than sure we are brothers in faith. It is not

    a controversial issue.

    1. We are as we are because Yahood-0-Nisara is conspiring against us?

    Mainly because of our own doings and character loopholes and partly because of them as what ever they plan and do, they always include anti-muslim agenda on priority bases in their planning. We had been duly warned about them in our holiest of all holy books.

    8, We’ll bring down USA as we did to USSR?

    Certainly you cannot. Stop electing criminals, opportunists, beggars looking for others for alms and sorts of help, convicts, and those holding dual nationality, and particularly stop infighting. When you will be able to seek, identify and eliminate the enemy within, for the sake of Islam and Pakistan (including all as Pakistanis) yes, than you can.

    semirza



  • Two nations theory is real bollocks.

    During my school days in Pak reading all the pak study and social study books i was a big fan of Two nation Theory. It was my favt question during school exams.

    But after leaving Pakistan for Higher study i started to realize we were taught a lot of filth during our school days and all brainwashing.

    Two nation theory is based on all crap asumptions.

    Why cant muslims live with other religions. Islam never says that as a muslim you should not live with other religios. Even as a muslim you cant live with muslims of other cultures and countries. I remember 5 years back me and my mate were looking for new place to live in London. We were looking around and found a decent place but my mate refused because the other house residents were Muhajer Guys from Karachi and my mate didnt want to move with Urdu speaking people.

    Two Nationa Theory Sank the day Bangladesh came into being. Why they wanted a separate land for Bengalis as Per TWO NATION THEORY THEY SHOULD BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO LIVE WITH THERE MUSLIM BROTHERS FROM West Pakistan.



  • latentry..

    I doubt ur story of Muhajir guys living next to your proposed area of residence. Tell me one area in London which is predominantly populated with Urdu speakers! Though on the other hand u can find Punjabis everywhere in london like Bengalis and Gugoo's!



  • @ Khan_Sahib

    I am not saying that there is any area in London which is predominantly populated with Urdu speakers.

    The ones i am talking about i found them in woodgreen.



  • I would like to add few more points in the list

    9. Two Nation Theory

    10. Good Talibans.



  • Latency! you became brainwashed after leaving Pakistan. I don't know that WHAT "Higher studies" we take abroard which almost change our Identity. For me it became opposite. I see Truth in Two Nations Theory and I see it more clearly after some studies.

    Fahim, Latency and you all who denied Two Nation Theory, For your POOR information, this theory is QURANIC, it is NOT formation of any man or leader. GO and READ that mentioned BOOK, with UNDERSTANDING, not only in arabic for the sake of 'Sawab' as most of the muslims do. Read it with Understanding so you will find it. I severe you NEED to read that book.

    raheb