Imran Khan is a liberal !



  • An iteresting debate on PTI's website !

    http://www.insaf.pk/Media/InsafBlog/tabid/168/articleType/ArticleView/articleId/1981/In-defense-of-Imran-Khan-Who-is-a-Liberal.aspx

    Comments

    By Irfan Shah @ Sunday, March 15, 2009 1:12 AM (irfanshah)

    Great insight Khawar Sahib.

    Thankyou very much for writing something which was really needed.

    I do think that there may not be as many liberals believing in Imran Khan as we like to assume there are. But I am sure with articles such as this one, it would remove some of the misconceptions about Imran Khan.

    I would suggest you to get the article in major newspapers as well.


    By Irfan Shah @ Sunday, March 15, 2009 3:13 AM (irfanshah)

    Btw, I have published your piece on my blog.

    Link: http://cli.gs/HJrRmP


    By safdar @ Monday, March 16, 2009 11:07 AM (sescohk)

    http://www.ourbeacon.com/cgi-bin/bbs60x/webbbs_config.pl/page/1/md/read/id/30803


    By Sikandar Bilal Khattak @ Tuesday, March 17, 2009 1:10 AM (Sikandar Bilal Khattak)

    such replied to be posted on real platform. here mostly Insafian comes some other forums . :O


    By Mullah Omar @ Wednesday, March 18, 2009 2:35 PM (Mullah Omar)

    "he is a true liberal at heart. Like Mohammad Ali Jinnah, whose politics was principle based and issue oriented." ---- this really strange becoz Mr. Imran Khan wants to impose shariah laws once he is in power, whereas Mr. Jinnah was a secular person and for him Pakistan was not going to be a theocratic state where mullahs rule, but for Jinnah Pakistan was supposed to be secular state where everyone would be equal citizen irrespective of his/her caste or creed !!


    By Mullah Omar @ Wednesday, March 18, 2009 3:07 PM (Mullah Omar)

    "Mr. Sethi forgot to mention that Imran Khan also lambasted Maulana Fazal ur Rehman by name, and other politicians who pedal religion in general."

    Why Imran Khan voted for Mullah Fazal ur Rehman ????


    By Paki @ Thursday, March 19, 2009 11:06 AM (Pakiza)

    Mr Mullah Omer

    one thing I can say is you need to know the fact.Imran voted for Amin Fahim when he was competing Fazal and Shaukat Aziz.

    You seem to be either a lier or uneducated.


    By Paki @ Thursday, March 19, 2009 11:09 AM (Pakiza)

    I have got a question for Mr Omer.

    Quaid was laeding the party "Muslim League" but he did form his own party which would have been called "secular league" or why did not he change the name of the party?

    Why Quaid said that Pakistan doesn't need any constitution as Quran is the constitution of Pakistan?

    Mr Omer you have got your own opinion but what if you are uneducated?


    By Mullah Omar @ Thursday, March 19, 2009 8:32 PM (Mullah Omar)

    Imran Khan voted for Fazal Rehman

    "Once in office, Khan voted in favor of the pro-Taliban Islamist candidate for prime minister in 2002, bypassing Musharraf's choice."

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imran_Khan

    http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/005/658vhcpk.asp?pg=1


    By Mullah Omar @ Thursday, March 19, 2009 8:34 PM (Mullah Omar)

    Mr. Jinnah was secular and he wanted a secular muslim state.

    His model was modern Turki of Kamal Ata Turk !

    Mr. Jinnah was not a mullah and he even got married with a parsi lady. For him religion was no the business of state it was rather eferyone' personal matter.


    By Moiz Masood @ Friday, March 20, 2009 2:06 AM (distinctmoiz)

    All of you MUST check this...

    http://cyclewalabanda.blogspot.com/2007/09/pakistan-ka-matlab-kya-pakistan-jinnah.html


    By Mullah Omar @ Friday, March 20, 2009 12:32 PM (Mullah Omar)

    @ Khawar

    You wrote "The reason that Imran Khan is still popular with the liberals is because they recognize that he is a true liberal at heart. Like Mohammad Ali Jinnah, whose politics was principle based and issue oriented."

    Imran Khan is Liberal !!!

    You people first need to know what actually Liberalism means.

    According to Wikipedia

    "Liberalism is a broad class of political philosophies that considers individual liberty and equality to be the most important political goals."

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberalism

    Imran Khan wants imposition of Sharia in Pakistan.

    http://letusbuildpakistan.blogspot.com/2009/01/imran-khan-demands-imposition-of.html

    So you people see Imran Khan is not a liberal person at all as IK likes to impose Shariah and hence non-muslim citizens of pakistan which are around 6 million will become second class citizens.

    Moreover, Imran Khan also supports Talibans who are against individual liberty and equality.

    And still you guys think that IK is liberal !!!


    By Mullah Omar @ Friday, March 20, 2009 12:52 PM (Mullah Omar)

    @Tahir Naqash

    --"I have got a question for Mr Omer.

    Quaid was laeding the party "Muslim League" but he did form his own party which would have been called "secular league" or why did not he change the name of the party?"

    First you need to know the meaning of secularism in order to understand that Mr. Jinnah firmly believed in secularism and he actually wanted Pakistan to be a secular state.

    According to Wikipedia

    "Secularism is the assertion that governmental practices or institutions should exist separately from religion and/or religious beliefs."

    Therefore, a person can be a secular muslim just like Mr. Jinnah who believed that all the citizens of Pakistan will be equal citizens i.e. even non-muslim can become President or PM of Pakistan just like India where muslims have become presidents and present PM is a sikh !

    ----"Why Quaid said that Pakistan doesn't need any constitution as Quran is the constitution of Pakistan? " ---- give me the source when and where Mr. Jinnah said this.

    ----"Mr Omer you have got your own opinion but what if you are uneducated?'


    LOL :) yes i'm uneducated and only members of PTI are educated !!


    By Paki @ Sunday, March 22, 2009 3:59 PM (Pakiza)

    @Mulla Umer

    Someone once asked Quaid e Azam what he thinks of the constitution of Pakistan.To which,Quaid said pakistan has got constitution in the form of Quran.That't why he never came up with any constitution and did not ask Liaqat Ali Khan and other leaders to come with man made constituion.

    My question to you should be,why Quaid did not come up with any constitution?

    Well,both Imran and PTI don't support Taliban at all.What we say is ,we are against war against terror as it has been drifting Pakistan and Afghanistan to civil war.Hence we are against the strategy being adopted to curb terrorism and secondly War against Terror is being fought on Americn terms.

    Now my question to you should be,

    when did Imran say that we support Taliban?hs Imran ever supported Taliban finacialy?To get the answer to this question,you had better watch 'JawabDeh' which was shown on Geo Tv in the last weak of Feb 2008.

    Imran clearly says that Taliban did not server Islam and that clealy shows that we are against the kind of Islam adopted by taliban.

    In fact the problem with you is,you are rather driven by anti Imran camp which is trying to portray him as Pro-Taliban which is based on lies and ignorance.

    Sharia means Islam is the law of the land.Noone can deny the fact that man made laws are inadequate and don't fulfill the purpose.Islam promotes equality and justice.I just would narrate an incident which happened in Holy prophet life.

    "Once Holy Prphet was sitting with one of his fellows and suddenly some jews were going to their graveyard for the funeral of a jew.When Holy prophet saw them he stood up in respect and his fellow asked him why you stood up for the funeral of a jew.Holy prophet replied that Islam teaches us to respect eveyone.

    You defined Liberalism correctly but you failed to come up with any conviction that what makes PTI and Imran against liberalism.freedom of any person is one thing but law has to be supreme.If by Liberalism you mean that any one can commit sins and there should be no law for him then you had better first educate yourself.

    We support personal liberty to the extent unless it affects someone else.Personal Liberty means for example you can get education of your choice and we support that.But we don't support: corruption one commits with his choice,drinking publicly and teasing women publicly etc.

    This all needs to be defined and as I said Law has to be supreme.


    By Mullah Omar @ Tuesday, March 24, 2009 3:12 AM (Mullah Omar)

    @Tahir Naqash aka Paki

    You said "Someone once asked Quaid e Azam what he thinks of the constitution of Pakistan.To which,Quaid said pakistan has got constitution in the form of Quran." Could you please advise me source. And by the way who was "somone" and why there is "once" instead of exact date !

    "My question to you should be,why Quaid did not come up with any constitution?" Why you people try to pose yourself as expert ? and in reality you know nothing about constitutional history of Pakistan. Mr. Jinnah was elected first president of Constituent Assembly of Pakistan on 11th August 1947. If Mr. Jinnah thought Pakistan has got Quran as a constitution then why did he formed Constituent Assembly whose primary responsibility was to form a constitution of Pakistan. He also delivered his famous speach on that day, wherein he clearly said that "You are free; you are free to go to your temples, you are free to go to your mosques or to any other place of worship in this State of Pakistan. You may belong to any religion or caste or creed - that has nothing to do with the business of the State."

    and he also said " We are starting with this fundamental principle that we are all citizens and equal citizens of one State. "

    He further said " Now, I think we should keep that in front of us as our ideal and you will find that in course of time Hindus would cease to be Hindus and Muslims would cease to be Muslims, not in the religious sense, because that is the personal faith of each individual, but in the political sense as citizens of the State."

    http://pakistanspace.tripod.com/archives/47jin11.htm

    You further said “Well,both Imran and PTI don't support Taliban at all.What we say is ,we are against war against terror as it has been drifting Pakistan and Afghanistan to civil war.Hence we are against the strategy being adopted to curb terrorism and secondly War against Terror is being fought on Americn terms.” Hmmm Imran Khan actually impilicitly supports Talibans by terming their brutal actions against innocent Pakistanis as a reaction of American-led war on terror. Could you please tell me why your leader doesn’t condemn Talibans’ actions unconditionally ? Why IK justify Talibans’ heinous crimes ?

    What are American terms ? What are Pakistani terms ?

    You also asked “Now my question to you should be,when did Imran say that we support Taliban?hs Imran ever supported Taliban finacialy?” Support to Talibans can be of two types explicit or implicit. Sometimes I’ve heard Imran as saying that Talibans brought peace to Afghanistan, by this way he explicitly supports former Taliban regime in Afghanistan, which was very repressive, undemocratic, and during which thousands of people belonging to Hazara tribes massacred, women were treated very harshly and were even not allowed education. And still IK praises Talibans ! Sometimes IK supports Talibans by justifying their heinous crimes. Now you answer my following questions

    1- When did PTI organized a rally led by IK to condemn Talibans crime against humanity in Pakistan ? Please tell me place and date.

    2- When did IK arrange a press conference, whose sole purpose was to condemn Talibans? Date and place please.

    3- When did IK visit Fata and Swat to show solidarity with victims of Talibans there? Tell me date please.


    By Mullah Omar @ Tuesday, March 24, 2009 7:32 PM (Mullah Omar)

    @Tahir Naqash aka Paki + all members of IK internet fan club

    Come on guys, you need to defend IK !!


    By Ahsan Mansoor @ Tuesday, March 24, 2009 11:21 PM (ahsan)

    Mullah Omar,

    what exactly is your problem with Shariat? Yes we want to bring Shariat in this country which means a society based on justice, judicial, social and economic justice. Our whole manifesto is based on shariat. This is not a secular party so if you had problem with basic ideology of PTI, you shouldn't be here at the first place.

    Answering your questions,

    1- When did PTI organized a rally led by IK to condemn Talibans crime against humanity in Pakistan ? Please tell me place and date.

    2- When did IK arrange a press conference, whose sole purpose was to condemn Talibans? Date and place please.

    3- When did IK visit Fata and Swat to show solidarity with victims of Talibans there? Tell me date please.

    Why would we protest against them? They are mere reactionaries to the government policies. IK has condemned them at a number of places (I can provide reference to video interviews), but why solely target them? They never were there before 2004 when government sent its forces to bomb its own people in return of getting salary from their masters in Washington. They are like mushrooms popping up on waste produced by the government. Clear the waste, reactionaries will die down themselves.


    P.S. You are also warned for trolling on this website with a fake ID. Either you update your profile to start looking like a real member, or you should unregister yourself. From your posts, it is quite obvious that you aren't really a member of PTI who believes in its ideology. FYI, this website is for members of PTI only who have signed the affidavit:

    "I agree to join Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaf having full confidence in its manifesto, and as a member of the party I will abide by its rules and constitution. I will support Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaf by voting for its candidate or helping the party in other ways."


    By Mullah Omar @ Wednesday, March 25, 2009 3:31 AM (Mullah Omar)

    @ Ahsan Mansoor

    You asked me---- "what exactly is your problem with Shariat?" ---- well, I am not a mullah and I don't want Shariah laws in Pakistan, whose founder was a secular person. Mr. M.A.Jinnah was himself Shia but he considered religion as one's personal matter and he never behaved like a religious bigot. As a follower of Quaid-i-Azam I also believe in secularism and I have a right to defend my leader. I can't tolerate if someone tries to malign my leader.

    You also said--- "Our whole manifesto is based on shariat. This is not a secular party so if you had problem with basic ideology of PTI, you shouldn't be here at the first place." ---- hmmm now cat has come out of bag ! It's pity that IK has been reduced to a mullah's level ! Now whose Shariat you are talking about ? Hanafi, Malaki, Shafai'i, Hanbali, Brelvi, Deobandi, Wahabil, Salafi, Ahl-e-Hadith, Ahmadi, Ismaili, Bohri, Shia, Talibani, etc etc ad infinitum !

    And BTW instead of imposing your ideology on others why can't you defend your leader and party rationally ? Don't you think it would be better for you to defeat me logically and prove that PTI has got persons like you on whom Pakistani nation can rely and depend for their betterment ?

    You further said ---- "Why would we protest against them (Talibans)? They are mere reactionaries to the government policies."---- very well said indeed!

    Dear two wrongs can't make a right ! First of all Talibans are not mere reactionaries they've got their own agenda. According to that agenda they want to impose their brand of Shariah on others by force. Talibans have so for killed thousands of innocent people through suicide bombings, target killings and beheading and still you are terming them as "mere reactionaries" !! Talibans have destroyed more than two hundred schools in Swat and Fata and still people like you term them as "mere reactionaries" !!

    Talibans are enemies of culture and have destroyed hundreds of music and barbar shops and still you term them as "mere reactionaries" !!

    Talibans have accepted responsibilties on attacks on hosipatal in Dera Ismail Khan and attack on POF in Wah and still you term them "mere reactionaries" !! Talibans have recently destroyed tomb of famous poet Rehman Baba and still you term them as "mere reactionaries" !!

    You move on to say that


    "They never were there before 2004 when government sent its forces to bomb its own people in return of getting salary from their masters in Washington. They are like mushrooms popping up on waste produced by the government. Clear the waste, reactionaries will die down themselves."


    First of all Talibans were there before 2004 in their safe havens from where they used to mount attacks on ISAF troops stationed in Afghanistan. Moreover, Pakistani state had to start operation in FATA in 2003 as Talibans have challenged writ of the state there. BTW there wasn't any operation in Swat why Talibans played havoc there ?? Talibans have killed hundreds of Brelvis in Khyber Agency and hundreds of Shias have been killed in Kurram Agency by the Talibans. Talibans even killed dozens of millitants belonging to Ahl-e-Hadith sect in Mohmand Agency. Do you have any idea why are they killing people of other sects? The answer is very simple Talibans believe in a hate ideology and according to them everyone is heretic who doesn't believe in their brand of Shariah and he/she should be beheaded ! Now what we are witnessing in Swat should be eye-opener for you people. Talibans have banned judges to attend their courts and in spite of peace agreement they are still busy in kidnapping government officials and killing security personnels ! Talibans don't understand language of peace they only believe in use of force as we are witnessing in Swat !

    As you were unable to defend your leader and answer my three following questions

    1- When did PTI organized a rally led by IK to condemn Talibans crime against humanity in Pakistan ? Please tell me place and date.

    2- When did IK arrange a press conference, whose sole purpose was to condemn Talibans? Date and place please.

    3- When did IK visit Fata and Swat to show solidarity with victims of Talibans there? Tell me date please.

    what you wrote is very interesting indeed and should be an eye-opener for any person who believes in rational dialogue ---- " P.S. You are also warned for trolling on this website with a fake ID. Either you update your profile to start looking like a real member, or you should unregister yourself. From your posts, it is quite obvious that you aren't really a member of PTI who believes in its ideology. FYI, this website is for members of PTI "----

    Thanks anyway for your comments !

    Bye and peace for all !

    © 2008 by Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaf

    Source: http://insaf.pk/Media/InsafBlog/tabid/168/articleType/ArticleView/articleId/1981/In-defense-of-Imran-Khan-Who-is-a-Liberal.aspx



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